In a series of tense exchanges in Parliament on Monday, after the government’s referendum opposing EU-wide “migrant quotas” was declared invalid, Prime Minister Viktor Orbán went on the offensive. His main target was Gábor Vona, President of the far-right Jobbik party, who had called for the prime minister’s resignation following the failed vote. Mr. Vona had cautioned the prime minister against holding a referendum, for fear that participation would not reach the 50% plus 1 threshold necessary for it to be valid. Mr. Vona preferred to simply amend Hungary’s constitution to spell out that parliamentary consent is necessary before foreign citizens could be “settled” in Hungary. But Mr. Orbán’s referendum was little more than a political tool to focus Hungarian public discourse around an invisible, yet nefarious enemy and to push all discussion of domestic ills off the table. This same polemical discourse and the language of war will continue for the next 18 months, until the 2018 elections. Hungarians can get ready for months of wrangling about Mr. Orbán’s proposed constitutional amendment, as well as the usual fights with Brussels that simply bolster Mr. Orbán back home.
Mr. Vona stood up in Parliament during question period on Monday, and remarked:
“The prime minister could not keep his ego under control and he lost this battle. He has caused damage to the country. I am angry at you and I demand your resignation.”
Gábor Vona, speaking in Parliament on October 3rd.
Prime Minister Orbán responded by claiming that “Jobbik is cheering for Brussels.” The Prime Minister then claimed that the far-right party’s decision to become a lackey of Brussels is “an unpatriotic and inappropriate step.”
“These people are sell-outs,” said Mr. Orbán, before suggesting that Jobbik was following the instructions of its international minders when it calls for the prime minister’s resignation. “Nothing is too costly for Jobbik and they have only one goal: to defeat the prime minister, as was ordered of them,” charged Mr. Orbán. The prime minister did not clarify who might have “ordered” Jobbik to take him down, but considering that Jobbik is also now unpatriotic, perhaps Mr. Orbán will claim that George Soros is pulling Jobbik’s strings too.
Viktor Orbán in Parliament on October 3rd.
It was not just Mr. Orbán who decided to make Jobbik its main target the day after the referendum. There seemed to have been a coordinated strategy in Fidesz to go after their main opponent on the right.
Several Fidesz MPs insinuated that Jobbik members had secretly boycotted the vote. “We have to ask the question: did you even vote?”–asked Csaba Dömötör, a state secretary with the Prime Minister’s Office. Mr. Dömötör remarked that instead of campaigning seriously for a “no” vote, Gábor Vona “spoke about his eyebrow-plucking practices” in a tabloid-style television program that aired on Hungary’s ATV network.
In the meantime, Lajos Kósa, leader of Fidesz’s parliamentary faction, demanded answers from Jobbik as to why turn-out in the referendum was only 31% in the town of Ózd, which is led by a Jobbik mayor.
Mr. Orbán and Fidesz went after the left-centre opposition parties too, but it was clear that Jobbik was their main target on Monday. Mr. Orbán had already questioned Mr. Vona’s decision to try to move Jobbik away from the far-right and has implied that by doing so, the party is losing its “soul.” Mr. Orbán has a long history of destroying every competitor to Fidesz on the right–the last two and a half decades are littered with the vanquished, including the Hungarian Democratic Forum, the Independent Smallholders’ Party and the Christian Democratic People’s Party, which today is merely a subsidiary of Fidesz. Is Jobbik next?
Mr Adam, I don’t agree with most of your views. Although, I am a faithfull reader of your articles and it is good to read them. It keeps me sharp.
But I agree totally with this quality and well analized article.
Geza, Who cares whether you “agree with Mr Adam” or not?
What he wrote is incisive and well thought thru.
Who cares about your opinion Karl. I don’t. My post was not ment for you in the first place, but mr Adam.
I don’t think so, Chris. Orbán needs Jobbik to maintain his image as a “moderate”, and Fidesz as a “middle-of-the road” centre right party (which it is not). He can claim being centre right only as long as there is a party to the right of him. And their constituency is basically contiguous. As an opposition politician once put it (I don’t remember who it was): “The line between Fidesz and Jobbik is as porous as is the Afghan-Pakistani border with masses of people keep moving to and fro across it.” It may change, though. Jobbik is now making an immense effort to show itself as a serious, civilized party, and today there are several issues on which they are more moderate than Fidesz.
Jobbik is Fidesz’s out-of-power Doppelganger and extreme-right competitor for power: Dasselbe in Grau.
More important, the genuine democratic opposition (as well as the EU and worldwide witnesses) need to make the point very clearly that the 44% that voted (almost all NO) was no triumph for the NO vote.
It was a 66% refusal to reply either YES or NO to a bogus, catch-22 question, built on a false premise (“Is it (YES) or is it not (NO) true that you have not stopped beating your spouse?”).
The 66% majority rejected the question, and this is what the opposition campaigned for. It was an opposition victory and a government defeat.
Don’t allow Orban’s demagogic distortions pretend to Trump that fact.
Mr Hamad in your reasoning in 2003 almost 58% of the voters in 2003 (EU referendum) rejected the question of joining the EU, yes or no.
– NO for EU migration policies in 2016: 3,282,928
– YES for EU membership in 2003: 3,056,027
LOL no, if pro immigration side was sure to be able to win this fight the would either voted for yes or spoiled their ballot, if truly the people were in favor of immigration they would have voted in a way that show it.
Instead 90% of voters voted against it( this results is found when you add the no vote, the yes vote and the spoiled ballots), and it’s statisticaly impossible that the rest of the popultion would have voted in a different maner.
The thing is that most people don’t vote at referendas because they don’t care about them( it’s very rare when the turn out is superior to 50% in Switzerland) and because most of the time the people feel it’s just a waste of time.
Correction, it’s of course 56% to 44% (or 60/40 if we discount only the valid votes).
ORBAN’S PLAN B
The differences between the EU referendum and the refugee referendum are that (1) no one argued that the question was unclear, incoherent or manipulative in the EU referendum and (2) political parties campaigned for one answer or the other; no one campaigned for abstention.
In 2016, abstention was a third vote, against the referendum itself — and hence against the Orban government that imposed the referendum (as well as its 50% +1 validity threshold). And it wasted enormous amounts of public money campaigning for a NO vote and at least a threshold turnout. Orban lost.
As noted, the Orban government had itself doubled the higher validation threshold of 25% in an attempt to insure itself against outcomes that were negative toward the government or its policies.
Orban has hence been hoist by his own petard: The 98% of a 44% vote is invalid as surely as he would have declared it invalid if a vote to oust Orban had been 98% of a 44% (or 49.9%) vote. (And the 58% vote for the EU in 2003 is just as irrelevant to today’s outcome as is the 25% threshold in effect at that time.)
Trouble with self-serving jiggering of turnout thresholds is that they can rebound against you, no matter how strongly you control the media. Orban’s desperate Plan B now — to change the constitution to “legally” over-ride its EU commitments — would immediately lead to the cessation of EU subsidies and the initiation of expulsion procedures.
(It would also amount to Orban’s taking an invalid 2016 referendum as having conferred on him a mandate to secede from the EU, over-riding the valid 2003 referendum! LilliPutin may think he can fast-talk his way out of that one for his domestic constituency, but it won’t wash where it matters: in the rest of the world — other than Moscow (Mordor), though even Putin would probably have preferred that his magyar mole subvert the EU a bit longer, before decamping toward the despised east with his dosh. After all, Orban has been free to try to secede all along, without a failed bogus referendum. Now let’s see whether his captive populace will compliantly join his peacock verbunkos and dutifully force-march out the EU door with him.)
LOL no, to expell Hungary from the UE or tu cut subsidies one must have an hunanimous vote, the problem is the polish governement will oppose it, as well as the slovakian and maybe even the czech one.
(Of course, Orban will do his usual double-talk: The new law (if it passes) will be ambiguous enough so it can be construed domestically as a powerful assertion of Hungary’s freedom-fighter spirit, but it will be only symbolic, never explicitly over-riding any EU law. Orban will hope that this mounts him on a tank securely headed toward electoral victory. Whether the 56% abstention from the referendum was indeed an anti-Orban vote will become clear then. — Unless he co-opts the presidential sinecure, Putin-style, before that.)
Stevan,
Don’t fall for such trolling, which this is idiotic comparison is.
Orban is derogating the rule of law again, his own law at that. The referendum was invalid, the people did not support this idea, end of story.
The reference to the 3.3 million supporters is entirely frivolous – what if they were less than 3, what if they were 2, or 1? Orban is moving to act ignoring the will of the majority expressed in accordance with the provisions of the law, another proof that we have a dictatorship in Hungary today.
Has nothing to do with trolling socalled “observer”. Just plain facts, people like yourself can not stand.
Janis Boris,
The far right is Orban, in all but name:
In addition to your colorfully illustrated point,
His regime implemented most of Jobbik’s ten points,
the Jobbik party did not pledge to replace democracy in Hungary with a quasi fascist regime, Orban did it.
As an overstatement I dare say that Jobbik party (not all supporters) may become more centrist than the Orban gang, which is not the whole, traditional Fidesz. Orban’s unbridled corruption reinforces this perception.
In 2014 44% of voters voted Fidesz and 20% voted Jobbik, the good people of Hungary overwhelmingly agree with the Jobbik 10 points, deal with it.
Orban political survival rests upon his patriotism and the physical survival of Hungary.
Orban’s opposition and competitors’ survival rests upon Orban’s failure with his patriotism and the subsequent physical and cultural nightfall of Hungary in the present Islamizaton of Europe.
Richard,
Orban and patriotism? Don’t you believe it, as the cynical Gábor G. Fodor remark revealed. The bombast and empty rhetoric is only for you dupes, to make you pay for the new billionaires fortunes.
In fact the Orban regime is the worst enemy of the nation sucking it’s blood and sapping it’s future right now.
You “nightfall” or rather downfall, has begun, as the various indicators signal: from investment, productivity and growth to education levels to health to mass emigration.
Tell us more about the way the socialist governement turn Hungary into a bankrupt country ? and the way they stole billions not to talk about how they manipulated the people to support their deluded agenda by lying to them with various social promises they never kept…
Remember us the way the left voted in favor of Juncker immigration agenda and how they support the replacement of the native population with middle east aliens.
This would be interesting.
Sobieski
(insult to the Poles, you brain less fidesznik)
Yes it would have been interesting, if there was much to tell. The 70:30% system was probably there, but the corruption was still moderate, discreet and punishable at times, eg. Kisgazda xxx Bela, Fidesz Varhegyi, Socialist Zuschlag went to prison.
Corruption is institutionalized, Orban’s policy, says fidesznik Andras Lanczy.
The scale is staggering, measured in % of GDP, eg. Simicska 51 billion Ft in declared dividends alone.
And your lies are sloppy too – check out when was Juncker elected, you lazy freeloader, like most fideszniks.
Observer on October 4, 2016 at 6:23 am
I am sorry for being a dupe and can’t satisfy your intellectual needs. (looks like nobody can in this thread or is there anybody whom you are not stalking?) well I try again.
“In fact the Orban regime is the worst enemy of the nation”
The worst?
“Soros to make a killing with European ‘forced migration’ ”
“Now that the inflow of immigrants has been set up, I am going to invest $500 million to make the process unstoppable, endless and self-funding, and make a lot of money for myself at the same time. And since this is dressed in the language of compassion, there is nothing you can say against it.”
By Sam Gerrans an English writer, translator, support counselor and activist.
https://www.rt.com/op-edge/361376-george-soros-investing-forced-immigration/
Pingback: Jobbik wzywa premiera Węgier do ustąpienia | Europejskie Nacjonalizmy
Richard,
The lunatic fringe is quoting Orban and the latter is quoting the former, spicing it with some lies. Get it?
And, yes, I am stalking all blatant liars and nitwits and exposing them to the unbearable light of facts and reason.
So, Soros DID NOT say the above, here are his words, which are self explanatory, but for the dim minds:
“In response, I have decided to earmark $500 million for investments that specifically address the needs of migrants, refugees and host communities. I will invest in startups, established companies, social-impact initiatives and businesses founded by migrants and refugees themselves. Although my main concern is to help migrants and refugees arriving in Europe, I will be looking for good investment ideas that will benefit migrants all over the world.”
Observer on October 4, 2016 at 9:29 am
“Soros DID NOT say the above”
of course not, it was Sam Gerrans that’s why I wrote his name and “by Sam Gerrans.” and printed out the source so that everyone can read for themselves. I know your qualities and what kind of observer you are but this unexpected eruption of your intellect was a surprise even for me. 😀 😀
Now back to topic. Let’s see a bit more about it. For those who are interested in what W2EU is.
Viktor Orban should be in for the Nobel Peace Price:-
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/10/04/serbia-fears-tougher-border-hungarian-referendum/
Walls make sense, whether Mexico, Calais, Hungary or the Great Wall of China, lets build more walls.
The George Soros conspiracy theories are too funny. Richard I wouldn’t comment too much on others intellect if this is the route you choose to go. Orban HAS duped you and unfortunately many others. His survival rests on people that can be easily had.
Szilard?
It sticks in the craw that so many Hungarians villify Soros.
He has endowed the best university in Hungary (the CEU) when all other universities in Hungary are languishing at 600 or worse on the global list.
He has funded many of the senior politicians in Hungary as they received their education.
This is the list where Soros helped with their education – and who too willingly kick him in the teeth:
In Soros’s “pay”
Viktor Orban: April 1988 to (?) 1990
József Szájer: 1986 – 1987
Tamas Deutsch: 1989
Zsolt Nemeth: 1988 – 1989
Maria Schmidt: 1985-1988
Zoltan Kovacs: 1994-1995
Not many Hungarians know this – Hungarian politicians don’t like it to be known either.
Szilard on October 4, 2016 at 1:34 pm
Thanks, let’s take one more step and many more later if you wish. No rush. The name of Soros mentioned in the piece was not coincidence.
“Soros and his acolytes saw the importance of symbology in the writings of Gene Sharp of the Albert Einstein Institution in Boston, Massachusetts. Although Sharp’s catechism of how to conduct non-violent resistance and revolution has been likened by some political scientists to Mohandas Gandhi and Dr. Martin Luther King, his concepts on upsetting the political status quo appear to be borrowed more from the likes of Mao Zedong, Karl Marx, and Adolf Hitler.
Using the Sharp template and financing from Soros and the CIA-linked National Endowment for Democracy (NED), Symbols were used in the themed Arab Spring revolutions in Tunisia (Jasmine) and Egypt (Lotus) and attempted revolutions in Georgia (Rose), Lebanon (Cedar), Uzbekistan (Cotton), and Moldova (Grape).
It is now more than obvious that Soros and his minions, known as «Sorosites» – a clever play on «parasites» – in the Balkans, contracted with flag factories to churn out banners of former regimes in the uprisings in Libya and Syria. In Libya, the rebels who rose up against Libyan leader Muammar Qaddafi in 2011 brandished factory-fresh, still-creased red-black-green horizontal tricolor with the white crescent and star used by the old Libyan monarchy, the regime that Qaddafi overthrew in 1969.”
http://www.theeventchronicle.com/news/north-america/george-soros-false-flag-factories/
Source: Strategic Culture
Richard,
This is getting idiotic. Have a cup of tea, make sure you’ve taken.. you know. Lest you start seeing soros with three heads and six arms with claws dripping blood.
Observer on October 4, 2016 at 11:21 pm
A long post everybody please bear with me might worth it.
Now let’s take the next step as you are still addressing me.
One more URL about Soros and I am finishing him off with this post.
I certainly understand many of you are protecting him.
Not a very nice thing to choose his side because to make business with the evil goes beyond money. They will never forget and forgive they had to pay their minions who used his money, were jealous of his power and wanted more of his power for their own rise, who are experienced liars but only could narcotize their very own conscience by lying to themselves that they do the right thing, while it was nothing else than a selfish act but they were never be true to him and never loved him. Only servants. The evil see this through and will annihilate his own minions and underlings as soon as they run their course of usefulness or sacrifices them in exchange for his own safety and immunity when time to surrender comes.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-08-16/soros-hack-reveals-plot-behind-europes-refugee-crisis-media-funding-and-manipulation
That’s enough about Soros.
Now about Orban:
If anybody scrolls back to my old posts can see I have always opposed the fence, the billboard campaign of hatred, and the referendum.
Why??
The fence is useless and triggers and avalanche for other countries and only forces Orban to allow those who applies for asylum at the fence in the country and register them. Is this a problem? Yes a big one, I explain later why.
The billboard campaign? Clumsy symbolism and using hatred as a weapon is wrong as it is a two edge sword that will behead him on the way back when he loses control over his own monster child.
Referendum? I have already explained why. Not fully, though.
How Orban rose? Has he ever played by the rules? Never. That’s how.
And now at the sudden he started playing by the rules. The fence. He faithfully protected the EU and registered the migrants. Wait a second. They came in the EU through Greece the first EU country that took them in giving a damn to the rule and didn’t register them, just pushed them through. And Orban did it. Greece was the first and now the EU is trying to push the migrants back to the first country which dutifully registered them –Hungary.
They, Soros knew this front, he didn’t even need to reach out for plan B as the easiest thing to do is to be prepared that the opponent, the offended will apply Occam’s razor. The fence!!!!!!!! Instead of using his brain and find the only smart solution that would have scare the crap out of Soros. Mistake. Huge mistake. Soros knew that and was sure Orban will not be smart enough to cheat him.
So, Mr Orban, when two players compete and one plays by the rule and the other not, it’s always the one who plays by the rule who will be the loser and the one who cheats and doesn’t play by the rule will be the winner. And you for the first time in your life started to play by the rule.
I told many times before, the first time you do this, you do good things you’ll be the loser.
Unless you have more ace to play.
————-
Sorry for the spelling and grammar mistakes I only had a few minutes to type this at light speed and not one to proofread.
Came out today that Orban voted For the quotas and that he had 6 different occasions to veto but didn’t. How can anyone stand up for this guy?
Mark,
Lying is the life form of this Orban character. His whole career has been a string of lies, the J. Debreceni biography revealed he was a sneaky cheat and liar in childhood.
Admittedly a highly skilled one, who knows how to manipulate the damaged Psyche of the average Hungarian.
Soros is surely a big philanthropist, supporting freedom, democracy, transparency, education, etc. All these are threats to the orban regime, no wander they hate him.
The regime pays foreign agents/lobbyists many millions of dollars to wash the brown dirt off Orban’s image, eg. the Szazaveg $ 5 million contract with two US lobbists. Soros is giving. Orban is taking away.
… no wonder..